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	<title>Comments on: The Alberta Tar Sands And The Environment: Does Canada Set the Agenda or will the U.S. Determine our Fate?</title>
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	<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/?utm_source=rss&#038;utm_medium=rss&#038;utm_campaign=the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate</link>
	<description>Informed Vote (informedvote.ca) will keep Canadian voters informed on Canadian Politics such as Stephen Harper, Michael Ignatieff, Jack Layton, Liberals, Conservatives, NDP, Green, as well as foreign issues like the Israel palestine conflict and local issues like the CUPE strike</description>
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		<title>By: GS</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-5599</link>
		<dc:creator>GS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 13 Jun 2011 21:43:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-5599</guid>
		<description>Does anyone believe that the &quot;Government of Alberta&quot; would lift of finger to protect the environment if it meant less oil royalties? Big Oil and Albertan Government are different heads on the same body pursuing profit / tax regardless of the environmental impact on Albertan lands or, for that matter, the world&#039;s climate. The most senseless, stupid scrounging for energy to discount your children&#039;s future.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does anyone believe that the &#8220;Government of Alberta&#8221; would lift of finger to protect the environment if it meant less oil royalties? Big Oil and Albertan Government are different heads on the same body pursuing profit / tax regardless of the environmental impact on Albertan lands or, for that matter, the world&#8217;s climate. The most senseless, stupid scrounging for energy to discount your children&#8217;s future.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Ramphal</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4902</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Ramphal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 16:01:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4902</guid>
		<description>Thanks for your efforts Study; there&#039;s nothing like free advertising.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for your efforts Study; there&#8217;s nothing like free advertising.</p>
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		<title>By: Study</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4901</link>
		<dc:creator>Study</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Feb 2010 12:13:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4901</guid>
		<description>This is a great site, I love the theme you are using. I Stumbled it for you and bookmarked it on Digg.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a great site, I love the theme you are using. I Stumbled it for you and bookmarked it on Digg.</p>
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		<title>By: All Things Eco Blog Carnival Volume Seventy Eight &#187;&#160;Focus Organic.com</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4120</link>
		<dc:creator>All Things Eco Blog Carnival Volume Seventy Eight &#187;&#160;Focus Organic.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Nov 2009 17:42:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4120</guid>
		<description>[...] Birk presents The Alberta Tar Sands And The Environment: Does Canada Set the Agenda or will the U.S. Determine our... posted at [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Birk presents The Alberta Tar Sands And The Environment: Does Canada Set the Agenda or will the U.S. Determine our&#8230; posted at [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gina</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4038</link>
		<dc:creator>Gina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 17:18:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4038</guid>
		<description>The 20 year process just simply isn&#039;t good enough, Ms. Regan. 
Saying that the tar sands are viewed in a skewed manner when it comes to the enviromental effects vs. the economic benefits just demonstrates the kind of incredible negligence we have to overcome. It&#039;s the inability to accept what the future stores that disables us from seeing past the profit of oil and moving forward. 
Our finite oil resources aren&#039;t our most valuable resource, our land is.

In regards to innovation and ingenuity on this matter, you can find valuable information on actual mobilized ideas at this link: 
http://www.ted.com/talks/rob_hopkins_transition_to_a_world_without_oil.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The 20 year process just simply isn&#8217;t good enough, Ms. Regan.<br />
Saying that the tar sands are viewed in a skewed manner when it comes to the enviromental effects vs. the economic benefits just demonstrates the kind of incredible negligence we have to overcome. It&#8217;s the inability to accept what the future stores that disables us from seeing past the profit of oil and moving forward.<br />
Our finite oil resources aren&#8217;t our most valuable resource, our land is.</p>
<p>In regards to innovation and ingenuity on this matter, you can find valuable information on actual mobilized ideas at this link:<br />
<a href="http://www.ted.com/talks/rob_hopkins_transition_to_a_world_without_oil.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.ted.com/talks/rob_hopkins_transition_to_a_world_without_oil.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Jim Ramphal</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4026</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Ramphal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 23:56:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4026</guid>
		<description>Ms. Regan,

  I appreciate your attempts to place my article in perspective, but I would respectfully suggest that even if reclamation is a 20 year process, the very small amount of land successfully re-established in the over 40 year period of the industry cannot be considered substantial by any means.

  The caption of the second image in the piece is actually &#039;The effects of open pit mining,&#039; and was meant to illustrate the environmental impact during ongoing mining operations, and not to imply that the mined area would look thus during or after reclamation efforts.

  The theme of the article was whether or not the current state of tar sands production is as environmentally conscious as it should be, whether Canada should allow the United States to influence how our resources are managed and to draw attention to the shrinking resource of petroleum consumption as a whole.

  Obviously for yourself or Mr. Sands who have a vested interest in maintaining the current production methodology and the oil business itself, as well as those not associated with the industry such as indigenous peoples and other populations in proximity to the oil sands, these are issues of great concern, not only for Albertans but for all Canadians.  

  There is also no denying that a growing body of people around the globe are increasingly concerned about the sustainability of our fundamental reliance on the ever shrinking resource of fossil fuels, and the very real effects on our planet of producing a non renewable commodity that is expensive to harness and destructive to use.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ms. Regan,</p>
<p>  I appreciate your attempts to place my article in perspective, but I would respectfully suggest that even if reclamation is a 20 year process, the very small amount of land successfully re-established in the over 40 year period of the industry cannot be considered substantial by any means.</p>
<p>  The caption of the second image in the piece is actually &#8216;The effects of open pit mining,&#8217; and was meant to illustrate the environmental impact during ongoing mining operations, and not to imply that the mined area would look thus during or after reclamation efforts.</p>
<p>  The theme of the article was whether or not the current state of tar sands production is as environmentally conscious as it should be, whether Canada should allow the United States to influence how our resources are managed and to draw attention to the shrinking resource of petroleum consumption as a whole.</p>
<p>  Obviously for yourself or Mr. Sands who have a vested interest in maintaining the current production methodology and the oil business itself, as well as those not associated with the industry such as indigenous peoples and other populations in proximity to the oil sands, these are issues of great concern, not only for Albertans but for all Canadians.  </p>
<p>  There is also no denying that a growing body of people around the globe are increasingly concerned about the sustainability of our fundamental reliance on the ever shrinking resource of fossil fuels, and the very real effects on our planet of producing a non renewable commodity that is expensive to harness and destructive to use.</p>
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		<title>By: Alison Regan</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4025</link>
		<dc:creator>Alison Regan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 23:10:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4025</guid>
		<description>Having worked in oil sands development for the past 3 years and having a chance to see some of the reclamation work being done I feel that the tar sands are viewed in such a skewed manner.  I agree that it isn&#039;t the most environmentally friendly thing that we as Canadians are doing to our environment, however I think that the fact that only 2% of area mined to date has been reclaimed needs to be looked at in context.  A large majority of the area mined out is still being used, old mine pits are currently being used for tailings storage and reclamation is a 20 year process not a 2 year process.  Certificates of reclamation are not issued the minute that trees have been planted, but rather once it can be proven that the reclamimed area is self-sustaining.  

Oil sands companies spend billions of dollars developing replacement habitat for mining areas (notable the Suncor Wetland project), on revegetating the sides of waste dumps, above ground tailings ponds, and on developing new forms of tailings that can be reclaimed easier.  

The second image shown above (of what I believe is the Syncrude Mine) states that this is the result of open pit mining - it is not the result, it is an intermediate stage.  That pit will be filled with sand and tailings and eventually reclaimed onces mining is completed.  The result of this mine will be muskeg, swamp and boreal forests that naturally covered the landscape there.  In the mean time the most valuable resource that Alberta has is being mined and is generating much needed revenues for this province and this country.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having worked in oil sands development for the past 3 years and having a chance to see some of the reclamation work being done I feel that the tar sands are viewed in such a skewed manner.  I agree that it isn&#8217;t the most environmentally friendly thing that we as Canadians are doing to our environment, however I think that the fact that only 2% of area mined to date has been reclaimed needs to be looked at in context.  A large majority of the area mined out is still being used, old mine pits are currently being used for tailings storage and reclamation is a 20 year process not a 2 year process.  Certificates of reclamation are not issued the minute that trees have been planted, but rather once it can be proven that the reclamimed area is self-sustaining.  </p>
<p>Oil sands companies spend billions of dollars developing replacement habitat for mining areas (notable the Suncor Wetland project), on revegetating the sides of waste dumps, above ground tailings ponds, and on developing new forms of tailings that can be reclaimed easier.  </p>
<p>The second image shown above (of what I believe is the Syncrude Mine) states that this is the result of open pit mining &#8211; it is not the result, it is an intermediate stage.  That pit will be filled with sand and tailings and eventually reclaimed onces mining is completed.  The result of this mine will be muskeg, swamp and boreal forests that naturally covered the landscape there.  In the mean time the most valuable resource that Alberta has is being mined and is generating much needed revenues for this province and this country.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Ramphal</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4019</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Ramphal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:49:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4019</guid>
		<description>With all due respect to Mr. Sands, the government of Alberta, like all major petroleum investors, has a great deal to gain in the oil sands production industry as it stands, and a great deal to lose by recognizing the serious environmental costs of their business, and thereby lead them to make serious adjustments to the process.  The idea that they have and will continue to maintain the same level of concern for the aftereffects of their business to the environment as they do in maintaining the current levels of production and profit, simply have not been borne out by the history of the project.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>With all due respect to Mr. Sands, the government of Alberta, like all major petroleum investors, has a great deal to gain in the oil sands production industry as it stands, and a great deal to lose by recognizing the serious environmental costs of their business, and thereby lead them to make serious adjustments to the process.  The idea that they have and will continue to maintain the same level of concern for the aftereffects of their business to the environment as they do in maintaining the current levels of production and profit, simply have not been borne out by the history of the project.</p>
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		<title>By: Ambrose Macdonell</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4008</link>
		<dc:creator>Ambrose Macdonell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 19:20:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4008</guid>
		<description>Mr. Sands, 

That&#039;s a complete crock.  The Government of Alberta, the Electrical Distributors, and the Generators, are completely ignoring the obvious in a very misguided effort to defend that which is, vs that which could be.

Firstly, Wind Generation is a non-starter.  It&#039;s already been proven to be too costly as a result of tower and rotor maintenance vs the power generation to fully invest in Wind Generation.  That&#039;s a sop for the environmentalists, and you know it.  The symbol of it&#039;s success off the coast of Scotland has been almost completely shut down because it&#039;s too expensive to maintain.

Secondly, while carbon sequestering, clean coal technologies etc... are definately worth the R&amp;D and exploitation, they are in the end a finite product, and essential more so to our export revenue and job creation resulting from it.  

Solar power is or should be the primary target of the province.  Unfortunately, Enmax, and Epcor, and the cronies who are paid off through patronage in your party, are too short sited to see the writing on the wall.  

This province enjoys an average of 6.5 hours of sunshine per day, and solar technologies are now readily available.

Instead of allocating $20 or $30 million per annum towards conversion of households to electrical power, upgrading of the grid, and replacement of meters, they are too busy protecting something they don&#039;t even own. 

Enmax, and Epcor, don&#039;t own their source power.  They buy it from electrical generators, and resell it.  No business that doesn&#039;t own it&#039;s product can survive long term.

Meanwhile somewhere in the neighborhood of 650,000 homes in Calgary and Edmonton alone have an average of 400 to 800 square feet of rooftop quite capable of being converted to solar generation, thereby freeing the consumers from the grid, Enmax and Epcor from single source supply, and generating new revenue to sell onto the west coast grid, free from fossil fuel dependance.

What have they done about it... nothing, natta.  Nothing more than excuses and foot dragging, which will only force us to spend more money in the long run, for less return.

Get off your ass&#039; and start investing in the one source of power that is free.  

Conversion of homes in the province should be the first priority of our resource agenda.  Let the American and Asians suck on our oil and gas, while we create a generation source completely removed from the market. 

We meet our environmental concerns, our power concerns, and our export concerns all within 50 years by starting now.  Enmax and Epcor end up owning the technologies and the footprint, with no dependance from fossil fuels, and it costs less than $20K per household.

Even if the grid isn&#039;t ready, freeing households from it should be the first goal.  $20 million a year is 1000 households a year not drawing from the grid, and with bulk conversion the prices get even cheaper.

You can purchase conversion kits in China, capable of supply 60% to 70% of an average households needs daily, for less than $2500.00.  Installed around $7000.00.  That&#039;s close to 3000 households per annum. 

Enmax could easily afford $20,000.000 per annum, hell they could shovel $50 million per year in with no discernable effect on profit ratios.

Leveraging a cost/purchase subsidy program could increase those numbers by a factor of 10 easily.

So saying the PC&#039;s are taking a hand in renewable energy is specious at best, and just plain insulting at worst.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr. Sands, </p>
<p>That&#8217;s a complete crock.  The Government of Alberta, the Electrical Distributors, and the Generators, are completely ignoring the obvious in a very misguided effort to defend that which is, vs that which could be.</p>
<p>Firstly, Wind Generation is a non-starter.  It&#8217;s already been proven to be too costly as a result of tower and rotor maintenance vs the power generation to fully invest in Wind Generation.  That&#8217;s a sop for the environmentalists, and you know it.  The symbol of it&#8217;s success off the coast of Scotland has been almost completely shut down because it&#8217;s too expensive to maintain.</p>
<p>Secondly, while carbon sequestering, clean coal technologies etc&#8230; are definately worth the R&amp;D and exploitation, they are in the end a finite product, and essential more so to our export revenue and job creation resulting from it.  </p>
<p>Solar power is or should be the primary target of the province.  Unfortunately, Enmax, and Epcor, and the cronies who are paid off through patronage in your party, are too short sited to see the writing on the wall.  </p>
<p>This province enjoys an average of 6.5 hours of sunshine per day, and solar technologies are now readily available.</p>
<p>Instead of allocating $20 or $30 million per annum towards conversion of households to electrical power, upgrading of the grid, and replacement of meters, they are too busy protecting something they don&#8217;t even own. </p>
<p>Enmax, and Epcor, don&#8217;t own their source power.  They buy it from electrical generators, and resell it.  No business that doesn&#8217;t own it&#8217;s product can survive long term.</p>
<p>Meanwhile somewhere in the neighborhood of 650,000 homes in Calgary and Edmonton alone have an average of 400 to 800 square feet of rooftop quite capable of being converted to solar generation, thereby freeing the consumers from the grid, Enmax and Epcor from single source supply, and generating new revenue to sell onto the west coast grid, free from fossil fuel dependance.</p>
<p>What have they done about it&#8230; nothing, natta.  Nothing more than excuses and foot dragging, which will only force us to spend more money in the long run, for less return.</p>
<p>Get off your ass&#8217; and start investing in the one source of power that is free.  </p>
<p>Conversion of homes in the province should be the first priority of our resource agenda.  Let the American and Asians suck on our oil and gas, while we create a generation source completely removed from the market. </p>
<p>We meet our environmental concerns, our power concerns, and our export concerns all within 50 years by starting now.  Enmax and Epcor end up owning the technologies and the footprint, with no dependance from fossil fuels, and it costs less than $20K per household.</p>
<p>Even if the grid isn&#8217;t ready, freeing households from it should be the first goal.  $20 million a year is 1000 households a year not drawing from the grid, and with bulk conversion the prices get even cheaper.</p>
<p>You can purchase conversion kits in China, capable of supply 60% to 70% of an average households needs daily, for less than $2500.00.  Installed around $7000.00.  That&#8217;s close to 3000 households per annum. </p>
<p>Enmax could easily afford $20,000.000 per annum, hell they could shovel $50 million per year in with no discernable effect on profit ratios.</p>
<p>Leveraging a cost/purchase subsidy program could increase those numbers by a factor of 10 easily.</p>
<p>So saying the PC&#8217;s are taking a hand in renewable energy is specious at best, and just plain insulting at worst.</p>
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		<title>By: Gina</title>
		<link>http://informedvote.ca/2009/11/19/the-alberta-tar-sands-and-the-environment-does-canada-set-the-agenda-or-will-the-u-s-determine-our-fate/comment-page-1/#comment-4003</link>
		<dc:creator>Gina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 02:28:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://informedvote.ca/?p=1612#comment-4003</guid>
		<description>Duly noted, David.

The progress made seems impressive, and distracting no less, on the surface, yet I wonder if the meager 10 %, which the government has had decades to implement, is really something to be proud of? 

Or, is it just a smoke screen to placate the opposition? Like, as in: &quot;Hey. Look here. We&#039;re really doing something. It&#039;s not much, yet. But we&#039;ll get there, boy and girls. Have faith in your government!&quot;

Now don&#039;t get me wrong, David, I like the government for the most part. I&#039;m just pointing out the fact that we&#039;ve had less than responsible governments in the past. 

Who&#039;s going to pay the land reclamation bills anyway? The oil companies, that&#039;s who. Hence, the cutbacks. We all know how responsible the oil companies have been, too. 
How long will it take to reclaim our land? How much will it cost in the end?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Duly noted, David.</p>
<p>The progress made seems impressive, and distracting no less, on the surface, yet I wonder if the meager 10 %, which the government has had decades to implement, is really something to be proud of? </p>
<p>Or, is it just a smoke screen to placate the opposition? Like, as in: &#8220;Hey. Look here. We&#8217;re really doing something. It&#8217;s not much, yet. But we&#8217;ll get there, boy and girls. Have faith in your government!&#8221;</p>
<p>Now don&#8217;t get me wrong, David, I like the government for the most part. I&#8217;m just pointing out the fact that we&#8217;ve had less than responsible governments in the past. </p>
<p>Who&#8217;s going to pay the land reclamation bills anyway? The oil companies, that&#8217;s who. Hence, the cutbacks. We all know how responsible the oil companies have been, too.<br />
How long will it take to reclaim our land? How much will it cost in the end?</p>
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